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Kevin's 90Q: Boost still low

Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 12:16 am
by Quattr016
Hey all, name's Kevin,
I wanted to start a new project thread for my 90Q... er.... what use to be a 90Q that is. I had a thread over on mg, but it felt like it was starting to wander so just wanted to restart and concentrate my thread a bit.

Bought the car about five years ago now, I was sixteen at the time and it was my first car. At the time I didn't really know a ton about the B3's, just that they had AWD and the legendary audi 5 pot powering them and that they were way cooler than the all to common Imprezas and outbacks that seem to overun our North Idaho roads. So after much searching on CG and autotrader I found a pearl white 91 90Q in portland for sale by and enthusiast(Seems like he was on QW allot, but still haven't seen him around any of the other forums). Drove down to the Bigs junction on the WA/OR border for the test drive, funny thing is I had to have my older brother do the test drive as I didn't have experience driving a stick. :roll: It definitely wasn't perfect there was and exhaust leak, the tach only worked when the car revved over 3K, the radiator cap was cracked and leaked when warm, one of the bumper mounts was fubbard and the leather on the door cards was delaminating. But there were a couple plus's, he had redone the headliner, replaced the clutch master and slave cylinder and put in a new clutch, short shift kit, clear turn signals, 034 7A injector upgrade and a surprising lack of major electrical gremlins. I was sold, played around in the truck stops parking lot getting the hang of the clutch for awhile and then headed out on the open road. Only missed the intended gear a couple times. :D
This the earliest pic I have at hand, this was at the local autoX about a year after I bought it..... it stayed stock for a while.
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After a while I had noticed that it was blowing some blue smoke on cold starts and when taking off from stoplights, so I decided a valve seal job was in order. Only I wanted to try and do it cheap, i.e. with the head still on the block. All I'll see is NEVER AGAIN, the whole procedure turned into a nightmare, I didn't drop any valves or anything but I ended up scratching the section of the head where the cam rides. So I ended up doing an entire head job and timing belt while I was in there. This is where the scope creep really began. Curious about how a short intake manifold would act on a N/A car I bought a 3B intake manifold and decided to pair it with a bag o snakes header which I had also purchased not to long ago. It had always seemed like the 7A ran out of juice above 6500rpm so I wanted to see if I could get that last 700rpm to feel a bit more lively.
This was the basic setup.
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At this time I also got 034's rip chip for the 7A ecu, so I was able to run the large V6 maf. Overall while it was an interesting experiment I can't say the results were overly impressive. Though I was never able to actually dyno it, the butt dyno felt like there was a slight loss of oomph down low and maybe a very slight gain on the topend. though it was hard to tell cause I never ran the small maf with the short intake setup. I will say it sounded 100x better, still miss the sound of those headers, was like a four door super car. 8-)
Then 3 months after getting it back together, this happened........
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Deer jumped out from the opposite side of the road, couldn't see it through the other cars headlights before it was too late. Clipped it going about 65 on my way to work at 5:30 in the morning...... Needless to say I was not happy.
Then I saw this..
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completely sheared the timing pulley off the cam, fortunately it only bent two intake valves. So, back to the drawing board. I was seriously considering parting the car out at this point and buying new. But I just couldn't do it. So the second wave of scope creep began...... Turbo time! :drive:
I was able to find most everything I needed for pretty cheap off MG and audifans and since i had the 3B intake manifold I was a little ahead of the game. At this time since I had to get a valve job done anyways I decided to have everything from my 7A head transplanted over into a spare 3B I had laying around which meant more coolant ports yay! Of course I didn't realize at the time what a pita it can be to get a 3B water manifold in the states, so in the end I ordered one from a guy in Romania. Go S2 forum! unfortunately while I was putting it on the first time I snapped the main part of the manifold due to the o-rings not seating correctly. :bangshead: So off the welders it went, cost me an arm and a leg to get it fixed, and when it went back on I decided to forego the o-rings and slathered it up with a good helping of ultra black gasket maker. Will get some pics of stage 2.0 up tomorrow, getting late so I'm calling it a night. Thanks for reading.

Re: Kevin's 90Q: stg 2.5

Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 4:28 am
by Hank
Heck yeah! Keep the updates coming!

Re: Kevin's 90Q: stg 2.5

Posted: Fri Sep 13, 2013 11:02 pm
by Quattr016
Here's some pics from the building of stage 2.0.
Modded AAN downpipe, just cut the bottom off where it split and welded on a 90. Needs reworking though cause it scrapes on large bumps.
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Tapping the oil filter housing for the Turbo feed line, ended up buying a complete set from 034 just for simplicity.
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Oil feed from the housing, had to grind a bunch off the A/C bracket to make it fit and even then it was still really close. Always hated the A/C system on this car and wanted to rip it off just for simplicity's sake.
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Here's one of all the plumbing with the A/C pump removed.
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Here's some of the engine bay under construction.
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Will post more about it tomorrow but here's the basic setup I was running.
3B head, fuel rail, throttle body, Intake manifold, exhaust manifold and wastegate.
Water cooled K26 turbo.
034 recirc valve.
7A block tapped for coolant feed to turbo.
034 rip chip.
5K air to air intercooler.

Probably missing some stuff but it's getting late again and I've got an early morning tomorrow.

Re: Kevin's 90Q: stg 2.5

Posted: Sat Sep 14, 2013 10:47 pm
by Quattr016
Well....... The 90 got ran into tonight. Nothing debilitating, but there's a 3" deep dent in the drivers rear quarter panel and most of the drivers side is scraped up pretty good. There's a 90Q in the local jy so I should be able to get new body panels. Any one know how hard it is replace the rear quarter panel? Will post pics up tomorrow.

Re: Kevin's 90Q: stg 2.5

Posted: Fri Sep 20, 2013 6:23 am
by Quattr016
Alright, well after looking at the damage in the light of day it really isn't that bad. So onward the project goes. Been battling a head cold for the past few days so that is the reason for my lagging in updates. So back to Stg. 2.0, I have to say I had a lot of fun with the car in this setup. Even with the turbo missing it's compressor seal and having boost drop off higher in the rpm range. Of course I didn't know it was missing at the time. Pushed it up to about 13psi and decided not to try for much more, I was pretty happy I could even do that without stacking gaskets and a 10/1 cr. Though looking back I was probably way overspooling the poor K26. The car felt very laggy, but once the power was there it was a thing of beauty. :D Here's a vid of me at the autoX a couple months back, been meaning to post this forever.
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NV1jobMITkM[/youtube]
Unfortunately I did have some major flaws with this setup and felt it could really use a redoing. One of the biggest was that the newly gained boost would pressurize the crank case and shoot oil out the breather, that's why I was only able to do a couple runs at the autoX before having to shut'er down....... So needless to say Stg.2.5 will be getting a catch can and possibly a new valve cover. :bangshead: About a month after this video was shot I ended up overheating the car, had the hose that runs from the back of the head to the heater core blow out and didn't notice till halfway back to my house from work that the temp gauge was not looking right. Thus began Stg.2.5 :beer:

Re: Kevin's 90Q: stg 2.5

Posted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 11:19 pm
by Quattr016
Alright so here goes, the building of stage 2.5. After overheating the car back in June, I decided a major revision was needed. While the setup I had worked decently, the engine bay was a cluttered mess and was far from ideal. So, first order of business was to remove the battery from the engine bay and into the trunk. This was the first battery relocation I had done so I decided to buy 034's kit for simplicities sake, much to my surprise running the wires through the cab was extremely easy. Especially because of my next modification, removing that damn A/C system. I always hated the A/C system on these cars since I started working on it, and especially after hitting the deer because at that point I couldn't ever really see it being a "clean" example of a 90Q again. Off it came...... The only part I was really sad about seeing it go is that I had bought the special oil drain for the turbo that exited into the 7A extension pan, which wasn't cheap. Oh well. Due to all the newfound space I wanted to rethink my intercooler system. The 5K intercooler never really fit right and also prevented me from running a grill cause it was so close to the hood. After looking around at my different options, I went with an AWIC. Bought a kit from frozenboosts website and was able to find a radiator that would just squeeze into the front of the 90. Of course this meant new crossmembers.
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For the top crossmember I kept my old custom piece and just welded on new brackets.
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together.
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trimmed and painted.(Farmyard style, Rustoleum hammered white)
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Now since the pump had to go at the lowest point in the system I put it where the A/C pump use to reside. This is the basic layout of the system.
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Now a lot of you may be asking, how the hell is that going to fit behind the stock bumper...... Well it's not.... Thus came the next project, modifying the stock bumper to accomodate the heat exchanger for the intercooler. Just a warning, no fancy RS2 or S2 content here..... Gets pretty ghetto fabulous for this part....
Here, you see the stock bumper.
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Hacking it apart.
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rebuilding....... yes, that is cardboard..... like I said, ghetto fabulous........ to the extreme.
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and reinforcing/sealing the structure.
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Finished product. Painted with spray on bedliner, seems very durable so far.
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Was my first time working with fiberglass, and overall was a good DIY learning experience. But will definitely need to be revisited in the future.
This arrived in the mail shortly after completion of the bumper!
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No more routing the charge air back to the exhaust side of the head!!! :guns:....... Needless to say I was pleased. Kudos to Hank, workmanship on the manifold is top notch. :) The fit is a little tight next to the powersteering pump which I think the spacer helped fix, but otherwise it fit excellent in the engine bay. Some pics of how everything looks installed.
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Unfortunately my radiator won't be seeing as much air these days which might be a problem. Thinking a hood scoop may be in order.
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..... maybe a little ricey. :roll:
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Actually just got it started last night! Big thanks to Jared (AngryTaco), he delivered the last few bits of intake plumbing I needed to finish the plumbing from the intercooler to the throttle body and helped me get the old girl running. Had a bit of a SNAFU figuring out the spark plug order (I know, I've owned the car long enough I should know the plug sequence by now.lol.). But once that was established it fired right up. Unfortunately the test drive was a bit of a let down. The car would NOT build any boost. I knew there was an issue originally cause the O-ring on the compressor housing was not in place which lost me a couple lb's boost but this time there was nothing. It was getting late though so I decided to leave it be till I could look it over in the light of day. Sure enough today I found that in my haste I had not tightened a clamp entirely and it blew the hose right off. Once that was fixed I took her out for another test run, this time the boost was definitely there. Though still not what it should be. I had tried to seal the compressor housing with ultra black, however it had obviously not taken. With a 1.8 bar spring cranked down on an adjustable wastegate, I was seeing a max of 8 pounds boost and it would drop off near redline. So I'll have to find a O-ring for sure now. The other oddity I noticed is that even cruising on the highway my coolant temp was staying at just over halfway, which seems a little high to me. I'm thinking the engine radiator just isn't getting enough air with all the new equipment in front of it. Was still great to finally get behind the wheel again, even with the massive boost leak it was a blast to drive. :drive: Here's a couple shots from after the drive today.
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Re: Kevin's 90Q: stg 2.5: pics galore.

Posted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 11:16 pm
by Quattr016
Minor update from today. Got a pressure tester so I could hunt down leaks in the charge pipe going to the engine had to tighten up one clamp on the intercooler and the block off plate I had made for the intake temp sensor was leaking pretty bad. Oh and of course my turbo was leaking quite a bit too since I am still missing the O-ring atm, should be here soon though. So resealed the block off plate and am waiting till tomorrow to let the ultra black cure fully. Also swapped in a set of HPR motor mounts today, so my engine doesn't dance around under the hood anymore. Went with the 90 durometer, so there is a little more vibration but really happy with how little movement there is from the engine. Will be getting matching transmission mounts in the near future as well, complete lockdown. :geek:

Re: Kevin's 90Q: stg 2.5: pics galore.

Posted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 1:05 am
by AngryTaco
WE NEED MOAR PICTUREZ OF HPR MOTOR MOUNTZ!!!

Once you get a wideband and the turbo buttoned up, we'll get that thing tuned nice. Hell it might even be faster than my 20vt!

Re: Kevin's 90Q: stg 2.5: pics galore.

Posted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 1:10 am
by 85oceanic
Looks like a good start to a project man! SO question, what's up with that bumper? I'm not trying to sound harsh, but I hope you have plans to fix it! :) I know where there is one locally that is pearl white that could be picked up on the cheap.

Re: Kevin's 90Q: stg 2.5: pics galore.

Posted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 10:32 am
by Quattr016
AngryTaco wrote:WE NEED MOAR PICTUREZ OF HPR MOTOR MOUNTZ!!!

Once you get a wideband and the turbo buttoned up, we'll get that thing tuned nice. Hell it might even be faster than my 20vt!

Lol. I apologize, got super lazy last night and didn't upload any pics to photobucket. I really need to get a digital camera soon, getting sick of posting up cell pics. :shame:

Yeah maybe faster than yours with the k24 on, but you'll be blowing my doors off in a week once you get the volvo unit on............. Maybe I should go find an H1C. :rofl:

Re: Kevin's 90Q: stg 2.5: pics galore.

Posted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 10:42 am
by Quattr016
85oceanic wrote:Looks like a good start to a project man! SO question, what's up with that bumper? I'm not trying to sound harsh, but I hope you have plans to fix it! :) I know where there is one locally that is pearl white that could be picked up on the cheap.

Thanks, yeah I'm psyched to finally be making some good progress. Lol. No offense taken, I kinda figured a lot of people wouldn't like it. I did it as a temporary fix for the winter really and it will be swapped out at some point. Though probably not too soon. The way I have the intercooler mounted it sits way out in front, won't even come close to fitting under the stock bumper. But I think I'm going to move the intercooler in the future, and then maybe go with a replica Rs2 setup or something. Thanks for the offer on the stock one though.

Re: Kevin's 90Q: shhh, I'm hunting boost leaks.

Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 11:32 pm
by Quattr016
So, small update. Got an O-ring for the turbo and pressure tested the system. Found a couple leaks in the plumbing to the throttle plate, got those clamps extra tight but I'm still only getting 9lbs boost tops and it will taper off at redline still. I'm using 034's 1.8 bar wastegate spring and I have it cranked down all the way with my adjustable wastegate so thinking I should be seeing around 15/16lb's boost? But ibviously something isn't right. I can pressurize the system and let it sit for about 2-3 minutes and it still has air pressure, don't know exactly how much but it sounds like a good amount of pressure is staying in there. Only other thing I can think is if my tune is way off, I don't have a wideband yet, though that seems like it would have to be WAY off for the turbo not to spool. Plus, my wastegate signal is comimg directly from my intake manifold so it shouldn't be opening at all until I have 13.5 lb's in my intake manifold right? It get's even better though cause if I stack my wastegate springs(my old stock 3b one and the 034 spring) the boost will actually go up to 12 lb's, so the wastegate is opening and I'm not just overspinning the turbo cause of a massive boost leak! :bangshead: Will do more testing on my days off, but I'm running out of ideas. Unless my boost gauge is bad, but I bought it new only about four months ago.

Re: Kevin's 90Q: shhh, I'm hunting boost leaks.

Posted: Mon Sep 30, 2013 11:44 pm
by AngryTaco
I'm suspecting you are going lean. Not enough EGTs or something simple is going on. Next time I'm up there, we'll play around with it

Re: Kevin's 90Q: shhh, I'm hunting boost leaks.

Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2013 10:58 pm
by Quattr016
Alright, one more small update. went through and found a significant boost leak in the charge piping, so redid the lines. Pressurized the system and there are absolutely zero leaks this time, made sure to keep an eye on the boost gauge and it went all the way up to 15psi and dropped slowly.............. But still only getting 8lb's boost.X[ Thinking maybe my exhaust is plugging up the turbo, but that's kinda a long shot I think.

Re: Kevin's 90Q: shhh, I'm hunting boost leaks.

Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2013 11:23 pm
by AngryTaco
Do you still have a cat on the exhaust system? I cant remember what you told me before

Re: Kevin's 90Q: shhh, I'm hunting boost leaks.

Posted: Mon Oct 21, 2013 11:48 pm
by Quattr016
yup, pretty much stock system with a cat, center resonator and muffler at the end. all 2.5" IIRC........ Although there is a hole right before the rear muffler that might just be giving me a little better flow. :drunk:

Re: Kevin's 90Q: Boost still low

Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 12:01 am
by AngryTaco
We need to get you a "test pipe". That cat is worth about $115 to the scrapper in PA. While I highly doubt it's the issue, that cat isn't meant to flow a super efficient turbocharged 20v. You may be running into backpressure issues...... :idunno:

You're in Idaho surrounded by forest, ditch the cat! :drive:

Re: Kevin's 90Q: Boost still low

Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 9:38 am
by Quattr016
I think your right, plus I could definitely use that money elsewhere on the car. I seriously need to redo the downpipe to though, the bottom is smashed pretty bad and is prob only 1.5' now. Idk how the hell people run 3" pipes AND lower their cars, mine is still stock height and with 2.5" it's still tighter than a mofo. Might just leave it for now though, really need this thing to get me through the winter and I still have to buy new tires and replace my rear balljoints in the next month. :bangshead:

Re: Kevin's 90Q: Boost still low

Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 10:02 am
by AngryTaco
Well theres an issue right there! Smashed downpipe will cause restrictions for sure. Itll all come together in time.

Re: Kevin's 90Q: Boost still low

Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 10:13 am
by Quattr016
Wonder how loud it would be with just a cut downpipe........ :police: :punch:

Re: Kevin's 90Q: Boost still low

Posted: Tue Oct 22, 2013 2:39 pm
by AngryTaco
Itll be cool for about 3 days lol. Unless you crash from excessive carbon monoxide poisoning lol