4 FOX SNAKES - Ross' 20vt 4kq

[85oceanic]

Make it happen man, and keep your chin up!

[EDIGREG]

Well that blows big time, but more importantly WHERE is it leaking?

Makes sense that 3 is so low if it has no fire ring.

[JonLENNY]

It can get depressing fast right

My 80q dies when my harness gets wet and I cannot figure out where or why.

Keep your head up and hope for as little damage as possible

[chaloux]

Well that blows big time, but more importantly WHERE is it leaking?

Makes sense that 3 is so low if it has no fire ring.

Not intake or exhaust. I absolutely know I pulled AT LEAST one fire ring out, but it could have been more. I'm hoping it's through head gasket into oil or coolant passages and then block, and not rings. If it's rings I seriously don't know wtf I'm going to do. I don't want to pull the motor again.

Ugh.

[EDIGREG]

Check for leakage out of the dipstick tube....hopefully nothing there

[WOMBAT]

Head gasket is easy. How do you replace a fire ring?

[chaloux]

Head gasket is easy. How do you replace a fire ring?

It's a part of the hg. On mls gaskets it's a ring that is ~ten thou thick that is bonded to one of the thin metal layers. So to replace it you simply replace the hg with a good one. I just hope that that is the extent of my problems, but like I said, I doubt it.

[WOMBAT]

Head gasket is easy. How do you replace a fire ring?

It's a part of the hg. On mls gaskets it's a ring that is ~ten thou thick that is bonded to one of the thin metal layers. So to replace it you simply replace the hg with a good one. I just hope that that is the extent of my problems, but like I said, I doubt it.

If I have to drive up there to help to get this done, just let me know. I think there are a couple others that would join

[Hank]

Washing down cylinders on a fresh rebuild like you did (VEMS trouble shooting for a couple of days without fire) is a sure way to get bad leak downs. I never recommend complete rebuilds with Vems installation unless it is absolutely needed.

[chaloux]

Yeah I'm not sure what the cause is whether it's poor break in due to trouble starting it, or the head gasket problem, or something else entirely (although tbh the motor wasn't run/cranked THAT much before break in, most of the trouble was after break in when I wanted to start and use the car normally). I had to use VEMS because of the 60-2 wheel.

[Toph]

It was good to meet you Matt, even though the circumstances were not ideal...I'm just glad to hear you made it home safely. Definitely hoping a new head gasket will fix it.

[Hank]

IIRC, you spent a whole saturday trying to get it to start with configuration issues, VR issues, and then coil issues. Doesn't take cylinders long to wash down. Backfires are really hard on bores as well, as it shoves the rings out mid bore, or wherever the rings happens to be.

Even so, I have seen guys take the pistons out the top with the oil pan off, then run ball hones down the cylinders and return to <5% leakdown figures from where you are now.

Hank

[chaloux]

IIRC, you spent a whole saturday trying to get it to start with configuration issues, VR issues, and then coil issues. Doesn't take cylinders long to wash down. Backfires are really hard on bores as well, as it shoves the rings out mid bore, or wherever the rings happens to be.

Even so, I have seen guys take the pistons out the top with the oil pan off, then run ball hones down the cylinders and return to <5% leakdown figures from where you are now.

Hank

Hnnnggg.

[85oceanic]

Man, I would just say swap the HG, inspect the bores and if they need some work (follow Hank's advice) then throw it all back together and get back to driving the dang thing!

[chaloux]

Well I wasn't expecting THIS. I am at a loss for words right now, so many things are going through my head - the whole gamut of emotions and different paths forward. I probably won't be around here for a long while so I can cool off and try to muster up some sort of desire to fix it.

Sorry the cylinders are dirty from coolant or fuel or whatever the fak.

Cyl 1


Cyl 2


Cyl 3 LOOK CLOSELY at the left intake valve pocket thingy


Cyl 4


Cyl 5



Dead piston buildup and valley on #3


Dead piston buildup and valley on #3

[Mcstiff]

That's a sad site

[EDIGREG]

Sorry Matt.

[85oceanic]

Dude. That effin blows. I'm sorry.

[UrSobsessed]

So bummed for you Matt! How that sucks!

[Hank]

oooohhhfff. That is a tough site to see. I sortof suspected it to be honest, but I didn't wanna blow it out of proportion until the head was off.

[loxxrider]

Is that the ring showing? What would have caused that?

[Hank]

Detonation, and lots of it by the looks of it. My guess is that the first plume of smoke towards the end of the first leg to Carlisle was that ringland finally letting go

[loxxrider]

OK, that is kind of what I thought. Then the question is, what caused the detonation.

[Hank]

Basemaps can be dangerous if the timing is not 100% spot on. trusting a basemap requires you to trust the base map maker( we trust MS), but a tooth off on the 60-2 can mean 6 degrees of advance everywhere, which would most likely be detonation city, regardless of how spot on the base tune is.

[jretal]

Ah, crap... sorry to see this, Matt! That really really really blows!

Take a break, walk away from the car and get your head straight again. Concentrate on the Mrs and the kiddo and leave the car alone for as long as you can last.

I had that same situation w/ a parts car that I bought to toss the motor in my 4000. My first MC1 had too much ring wear on the cylinders (big ridge) and couldn't be used. I bought a parts car with Marc S's old built 20vt in it STRICTLY for the motor, and was welcomed to a similar issue as you saw... but with JE pistons! Detonation is a royal b!tch.



Nothing any of us are going to say is going to make it better, but keep your head held high. You built it once, and you can build it again! Just take a little time and enjoy life so you don't pull your hair out!