Ben’s and then Eric's and now somebody else’s V8 CQ

[the german]

I did a very similar exercise to look at how the effective ratios compared to the gearing from Audi in the ABZ's original application: a 1998 A8.

Also included are a few Allroad applications from another project I was working on.

The data is displayed differently from what you did since my interest really was in engine speed at a given vehicle speed (looking for better freeway cruising and MPG). Basically the b5 S4 01e is a good improvement over the CQ 01a, but is still pretty far from what the A8 had for an effective drive ratio. The best I found was an 01E with a .56 6th gear.

[Grillage]

More fun stuff getting narrowed down as I get closer and closer to this being totally driveable.

Firstly, anyone have a good suggestion to ship a transmission from Poland? I'm thinking about an S2 trans from there.

Also,

I've been noticing that a lot of times while driving in 2nd or 3rd I get a hard jerk when I take my foot off the accelerator. Doesn't happen so much at higher speed / gear.
I read something on the VEMS forum about enriching the Lambda target at low rpm and low map - or do I want it rich at lower map?

any ideas?

[Grillage]

Here's a log I made today. First one I've posted in quite a while.

Starts in a parking lot, then a 40mph road, then highway.

Once I fix this bucking issue, the car will really be running well!

v3.3_u009476-2016.02.07-18.21.09.vemslog

(1.1 MiB) Downloaded 1615 times

[Grillage]

I talked to Marc about this and he thinks its likely a driveline bushing issue. The only real VEMS related issue could be to do with the overrun fuel cut. I'm out of town for a few days so when I get back I'll check the VEMS angle out.

Either way, I never changed mounts when I did the engine swap so I've ordered all new diff, trans and motor mounts. Hopefully they'll be here by the weekend.

[Grillage]

The issue above ended up being a fuelcut issue - super easy to fix but I replaced the trans and diff mounts anyway.

Now I'm tacking one of the biggest things I have left to make this car pleasant to drive - the loud groaning steering rack.
I've replaced the pump and have seen no difference so I am on to the rack next.

I took some pics during the process...



Had to disconnect the brake booster and the clutch master to slave line to get at everything so I'll need to bleed all that stuff tomorrow...


This "S" shaped wrench saved my life here:


Was able to get the old rack out without messing with the heater core hoses. They're homemade and have some give in them.
I did take out the tie rods from the passengers side as a single piece and then got the rack out...


Everything out...


I got the new one in, all attached inside the cabin and put the brakes all back together. Tomorrow I'll bleed clutch and brake lines. I've left the intake manifold off for now in case I need to get to the slave from above.

The damper is does not have a ton of resistance so I will likely replace it as well. Anyone know a good source for them? all the ones I found online were from the UK

While I'm in there and have the intake manifold off, I have been working on a solution to the coolant temp gauge being way off. The issue is that the sensor on an ABH gives a very different reading for 90* than the coupe's original Thermoswitch did. As a result, I've had an unreliable reading from the instrument cluster.

My solution is to install a coupe spec thermoswitch where the sensor on the ABH lives (drivers side head at the front by the radiator).

It doesn't fit thanks to the ABZ intake manifold so I did some trimming of the switch to make it work. I'll try to wire it up tomorrow:

Can anyone confirm that the pin that was omitted on the newer switches is the 15a pin?


In other news, I have another coupe that I'm in the midst of buying - also a red on black 1990.
This one is 73,000 miles and has sat since 1999.

[the german]

oh man, replacing the rack with the motor in does not look fun! My steering damper was blown too and I just removed it completely. I don't notice any difference and the steering feels good to me so I just haven't bothered to find a replacement.

What kind of shape is the new coupe in? plans for it? The one I just bough was sitting for 9-10 years.. it's amazing how much stuff deteriorates from just sitting. Hopefully hours was stored inside unlike mine!

[Grillage]

I'm not sure yet on the new coupe. The seller is an older Audi enthusiast who doesn't do technology well so getting pics and the like has been slow. The car appears to be in pretty good shape from what I've seen but you never know. For the price I'm paying it could end up a parts car and I'd break even.

Worst case scenario it becomes a parts car for this coupe and I scrap the shell after parting whatever else is useful.

I might get it running and sell it (the wife is not excited about a fifth car in the driveway and I'm about to build a garage so the driveway is soon to be a construction zone for some time)

If it's as nice as I hope, it is going to be a 20v turbo build. My dad who turns 70 next week is a Porsche guy but also a mechanical engineer. He loved my urs6 and specifically the engine. It would be fun to do a build that he and I could work on together. Plus I'd love an s2 clone!

[PRY4SNO]

Nice work replacing the rack, that was a royal PITA to do with the 5-cyl removed... and you had a v8 to maneuver around!

I didn't end up replacing the damper but am eyeing a solution ala Funk Weasel's 'Yet Another Cookie Cutter Cq Project' where he used a more robust Mercedes damper. Part numbers follow:

ATM 0004635132
-or-
ATM 1244630432

[Grillage]

Yeah, If I ever have the engine out of a car I'll do the steering rack as preventative maintenance! I'd gladly pay $150 for a new one to avoid doing this with the engine in.

I found another potential option just now on the S2 forum:
http://www.s2forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=73381

[PRY4SNO]

Looks like the same one as above. There are a few options available, that's what held me off from making a purchase. Intuitively, I wanted the Bilstein version but just never bit the bullet.

This looks like a good option:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-Mercedes-Be ... r#shpCntId

In fact, if shipping didn't nearly double the cost I'd be all over it.

[Grillage]

Is the FEBI 01261 the same as the Mercedes one? It's super cheap and appears to be available

[Grillage]

I finished this up over the weekend and unfortunately there is no change in my steering groan

I bought the rack refurbished from a reputable seller (jorgen) so I assume it is good.

This all started because on one of the first test drives I lost all the fluid in the pump and started noticing the noise. To be fair, there was so much weird on this car before then that the noise could have been there first.

So I replaced the pump with one from Force5 which ended up being a bad pump (locked up inside and the Pistons didn't move). Then I replaced it again with another pump from them and there was no change from my pump so I went on to the next thing - the rack.

Now a replaced rack shows no change.

A couple possibilities:

My pump and the replacement pump from force5 have the exact same issue and I need to replace with a known working pump.

My removal of Pistons from the pump to delete the brake bomb was wrong and has caused the problem

Something else?


Has anyone done the pump mod that can confirm I did it right?
I removed the center of the three grouped Pistons, springs and rods.These are smaller in size than the other Pistons.

[WOMBAT]

Are there filters in the fluid reservoir or lines? For someone else to answer, I don't actually know.

[dana]

the 90 and CQ reservoirs have pretty fine filter inside under that cap, you can tank it out and take a look, but ive never seen on very plugged.

[the german]

Is the groan clearly coming from the pump? Couldn't be something silly like a bad strut mount making angry noises?

With the car running, have someone sit in side and turn the wheel while you stand outside and listen for the source of the noise. Try it without the car running as well.

[Grillage]

I'm vexed!

I've replaced the strut mounts and all the suspension stuff.

I've thought about a restriction somewhere in the pipes but I don't really know how to identify that. I guess I could disconnect the inlet outlet from the reservoir and measure flow rate?
I've replaced the fluid each time I've replaced the pump so I believe there isn't any issue with the Pentosin.

the high pressure hose was made by Spokane House of Hose for me with the proper ends. This below is what I used for the hose. Don't know if I have a pic of the finished hose.


The other question is about the little metal connector in the middle of both of these shown above. Does this have a specific orientation? Does it need to be one way or another? Maybe It needs to be reversed?

Don't know!

[varia]

i cant really recall it, but two years ago at bbq5 when Doug (a6 avant converted euro s6+) told me about his power steering problem.
One of his hose was made, like yours. And once he replaced that with a factory one the problem whet away.
I will try to find the his topic for you, Ben.


ok, here:
"After the engine swap I needed to fabricate a custom pressure line to the rack from the new pump location. *Should* have used SHOH from the beginning but went to Parker Hose because they were local. Big mistake. The guy there made me a nice looking hose but despite my asking about the restrictor the factory used he insisted I'd have no issues with it and it wasn't necessary . From the get-go it had a constant whine...."

http://forums.quattroworld.com/s4s6/msgs/296681.phtml

[Grillage]

Thanks Chris,

I must have read this at some point. It seems familiar.

I too used Spokane House of Hose and I had that restrictor kept in the line. Or a restrictor of some kind.

Meanwhile, If I can't figure out how to keep this car dry inside for good I'm driving it off a cliff.

[Grillage]

interesting,
I emailed with Doug and he used a 12v V6 steering pump on his build. I am trying to figure out how that works.

His problem was that there was too much pressure without the restrictor and adding it made the noises go away.
Maybe the V8 pump has too much pressure for the CQ rack regardless of the restrictor?

[gabriel.b]

There are 3 pistons in that pump? AAN has 2 and i believe 7a has only 2.

Check the pressure on the pump information plate, AAN is 120 bar, so that should be what the rack needs.

You can try putting Lucas power steering stop leak (the one with conditioners) in (its safe for the seals) if its because of the pump being bad, this should make it go away or at least get better for a while.

[the german]

for what it's worth, I'm running the ABZ pump with no modification and lines made up at a local hydraulic shop. Works great with no issues.

[Grillage]

Kirk, do you have a restrictor in the line?

Also the ABZ doesn't have the provision for the brake booster so a slightly different pump.
Hmm

[varia]

There are 3 pistons in that pump? AAN has 2 and i believe 7a has only 2.

Check the pressure on the pump information plate, AAN is 120 bar, so that should be what the rack needs.

You can try putting Lucas power steering stop leak (the one with conditioners) in (its safe for the seals) if its because of the pump being bad, this should make it go away or at least get better for a while.

nope. its a small chassis rack, 90bar. that extra 30 bar (430 psi) will kill it
while the 90/cabriolet pump looks like the pump from the C4 A6, they are not. many made this mistake when converting the brake booster

[the german]

Kirk, do you have a restrictor in the line?

Also the ABZ doesn't have the provision for the brake booster so a slightly different pump.
Hmm

No restrictor in the line on mine.

[alxdgr8]

Pretty sure I too have the V6 pump on mine with a custom bracket.

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